Firearm discussion (no politics)

[MrHaaax]

A government chambered for .357 Magnum? I'll take two, please.

[Ozone]

while you hear all the neo-Nazis praising german WWII weapons you never hear of the ones they cranked out when they were about to lose
the german Volkssturmgewehr or people's militia rifle in English translation

intended to be a mass produced semi-auto rifle that was easy to produce
since it was almost a make-shift weapon its reliability was second to none and its accuracy was even worse.
also the mp 3008 which served the same purpose exept it was a submachine gun

and now for one that would have been a quality rifle... if it were produced.
the Luger Rifle

[CommieBuffalo]

while you hear all the neo-Nazis praising german WWII weapons you never hear of the ones they cranked out when they were about to lose
the german Volkssturmgewehr or people's militia rifle in English translation

intended to be a mass produced semi-auto rifle that was easy to produce
since it was almost a make-shift weapon its reliability was second to none and its accuracy was even worse.
also the mp 3008 which served the same purpose exept it was a submachine gun

and now for one that would have been a quality rifle... if it were produced.
the Luger Rifle

I'm guessin with some cleaning up and refining that VSG could look and work pretty damn good. The nazis had a tendency to overengineer stuff(aka some of the Tiger tanks, many of which broke down even before reaching soviet battles) and then produce it in the most loose way possible.
And that Luger is just plain smexy.

[ZEB 99]

lets discuss hi point,
personnally i dont like their handguns because they look pretty freaking ugly and arent ery good quality, i mean for $100 what do you expect, but the one i had for a while jammed pretty often,
their carbines are ok i didnt have many problems with my friends when i shot it, and the carbine doesnt look ugly,

[Ozone]

fun fact that is one of the most common firearms inside evidence lockers in america

[ZEB 99]

^i dont know how to respond to that really, i was going to say something but it went out the window

[EddieMann]

From what I've heard about Tec-9s being Jam-O-Matics, is that true? I mean, it may have jammed frequently, but not as much as the Breda-30, Chauchat, or the Fiat-Revelli Modello 1914.

More info on the Breda and Fiat:

Spoiler:

With the Breda 30, Its numerous design faults teamed up to make it an extremely unreliable weapon, especially in the desert conditions of North Africa. The gun attempted to use a blowback system of operation to reduce complexity, but using simple blowback for a high pressure rifle round required the rounds to be oiled to prevent them from being ripped apart during extraction.

This didn't always work, leaving the front part of spent casings hopelessly jammed in the chamber, plus the oil attracted dirt into the working areas of the weapon, causing another type of jam. Furthermore, the gun used the same bad idea as the Chauchat with an open magazine that invited even more dirt into the operating mechanism. Also, the closed bolt design reduced air circulation and also put rounds in the chamber at risk of cooking off which could injure or kill the gunner.

Oh, and, uh, the magazine was non-detachable, making use of special 20 round strips to reload it which had the effect of drastically slowing the rate of fire. So even when the gun actually managed to fire one would wind up spending most of their time reloading it. he worst thing about the Breda 30 is that it was not the worst weapon of the Italian Army in the war. That would be the Fiat-Revelli Modello 1914 heavy machine gun: designed before World War I, it had the same problems as the Breda 30 (unsurprisingly, the Breda 30 is based on the 1914), was water-cooled (increasing the weight), had an oil pump to grease the rounds (thus making it even more complex and heavier), and by 1940 it had been out of production for twenty years, thus adding the troubles of age and wear.

The issues were ironed out with the later Modello 1935, an improved model with air cooling, no oil pump and, most importantly, belt-feeding. Except it jammed worse with un-oiled rounds, so they had to put back the oiler.

More Info on the Chauchat:

Spoiler:

The Chauchat "Machine rifle" was the first squad automatic weapon and the most widely-produced automatic weapon in World War I. It introduced a number of features seen on modern long guns, including a pistol grip, an in-line stock, a fire rate selector, and stamped steel components to simplify production. As with many pioneering designs the weapon had several design faults, including a relatively complicated feed path necessitated by the heavily tapered case of the standard French 8mm Lebel cartridge (an issue that would plague all French efforts at automatic weapons until the modern straight-cased 7.5x54mm was introduced in 1929), and the use of long recoil operation.

There were also production issues stemming from the traditional arms manufacturers being fully utilized to make traditional arms, therefore Chauchat production was given to less experienced firms that resulted in quality control and other manufacturing problems, including poorly aligned sights, which were so common that it was nearly impossible to exchange parts between any two Chauchats. The major issue that was responsible for 75% of all stoppages were the open sided magazines which would inevitably become clogged with dirt and debris. Overheating was the second leading cause of problems with thermal expansion jamming the gun. Despite its generally lackluster performance it was still the only/best option available and saw extensive service by the French and 8 other nations during the war and beyond.

The Chauchat only earned its Rock Bottom reputation when the Americans entered the war and were issued Chauchats that were hastily designed to take the significantly more powerful .30-06 cartridge. The gun had trouble extracting the long, straight cases and was hardly up to the stresses of the powerful round. To make matters even worse, somebody managed to screw up the conversion between English (US) and metric (French) units, so the magazine and chamber for the .30-06 version were the wrong size (this error wasn't even realized at the time; it wasn't until private testing decades later that it was discovered, hence the error never having been corrected). It was so poor that it was used only as a training weapon, and virtually all of them were destroyed after the war. US troops were then issued 8mm Lebel-chambered Chauchats, which were considered better than no light machine gun at all (but only marginally sonote ).

One very significant issue for many people firing the Chauchat is caused by the long-recoil action: It is very easy to "limp-wrist". All recoil operated guns require being held firmly in order to properly cycle, or else too much of the recoil force goes into your body rather than the action, causing it to not cycle back far enough. Limp-wristing is well known to anyone with experience firing any Browning-style short-recoil pistol, like the M1911 or Glock. However, the issue is massively magnified in the Chauchat - the 8mm Lebel is not a light cartridge, and due to the heavy barrel and action travelling quite far due to the long recoil action, the gun wants to jump around all over the place. A very tight grip is necessary to keep it under control.

Post-war analysis showed that around half the Chauchats used in combat were dropped as useless by their operator before they could fire off an entire magazine; it wasn't uncommon for American auto-rifle squadrons equipped with them to give up on that and switch to M1903 Springfields instead. It jammed often and easily due to the above mentioned reasons, and the only way to unjam it was complete dis and reassembly — less than recommended in the heat of battle in no-man's-land. One may as well have charged into that trench with nothing but a knife, because it would likely outperform the Chauchat when it turned into an overly-elaborate and cumbersome metal club.

Source

[ZEB 99]

it may be like a p08, jams with american ammunition, but i am not sure

[EddieMann]

it may be like a p08, jams with american ammunition, but i am not sure

Iunno, since R. Lee Ermey tested a Chauchat for the TV show Lock 'n' Load and discovered that even on a modern gun range it invariably jammed after four rounds every single time.

[ZEB 99]

the only things i know about a tec 9 are secondhand, ive never shot one

[EddieMann]

the only things i know about a tec 9 are secondhand, ive never shot one

hm.

[Ozone]

tec 9's are extremely rare now due to the fact they were extremely easy to mod to fire full-auto.
that being said I've never even seen or knew someone who had one.

[ZEB 99]

http://www.americanspecialtyammo.com/12_Gauge.html
i wanna get some 12 gauge ammo from here

[EddieMann]

http://www.americanspecialtyammo.com/12_Gauge.html
i wanna get some 12 gauge ammo from here

http://www.firequest.com/exotic-shotgun-ammo.html

You gotta try these out. .50 BMG slugs in a shotshell, Triple Doom, with a slug, birdshot, and .4 buckshot in it. Flash thunder grenade shells, rock salt shot shells, Maucho Gaucho, Freaking CONFETTI rounds, and many other exotic rounds.

[ZEB 99]

holy shit